I just recently joined this site to get more book recommendations, and was intrigued by this post title. Thanks for sharing! And for taking the time to organize these thoughts well.
For the past 8 years, (starting one year into marriage and having a lot of questions) I've loved listening to the podcast "Java with Juli" from the website "Authentic Intimacy." She is a Christian woman who is bold in tackling many different sex topic conversations!
Sex is such a beautiful bit of intimacy, which itself makes it difficult to talk about, but for me that is another point in favor of fiction, because it let's you learn without intruding on real people.
I agree with most of what you've had to say here--and I've had the same opinion for a very long time, actually.
I still struggle with exactly where the lines should be drawn and how to approach the subject, but I have to say that the church's (and my parents') abysmal handling of sex was part of what got me hooked on porn in the first place (A twenty-five year battle I've finally mostly won).
(Along those lines, the one serious disagreement I had with you was about erotica. It IS the same as porn in every meaningful way except the specific physiological effects. That's not to say all portrayals of sex have to be erotica--they don't.)
That said, now that I've got one novel on the way to publication, I'm seriously considering writing a fiction book for young adults that will center on the theme of sexual identity (and will, necessarily, contain sexual content).
I'm still groping for how to go about it.
On the one hand it's *SO* necessary and lacking. On the other, it's *SO* taboo that it's going to be impossible to get it "right." (Offending people doesn't phase me, so long as my own mind is settled about what I've done.)
I'd love to talk more about the problems attached to this whole issue with people who are interested, especially because I'm in the position I'm in with my own writing.
Thanks for sharing! I would be interested in what you consider meaningful ways. In that erotica and pornography are both portrayals of (often absurd) sexual fantasy for its own sake, they are the same. (I have no interest in trying to make value judgements about sexual fantasies, that's between each person and God.) I think, however, that the moment you involve real live human beings performing for other real live human beings the differences become very meaningful. Because we have souls and value, consent is critical--and you have no way of knowing if porn is actually consensual for all parties. When it's a video or photo, that is a person with a soul actively being treated as an object.
Wow, that's a big theme to tackle! I think reading other books that deal with sexual identity would probably be a useful place to start. Then maybe think about what exactly you're going for--is it just not being shy about body parts, or does the story call for more? Is the purpose to explore your own identity or explore the concept in a way that might help others?
I think the lines fall in different places for different people, and that's okay. That's part of being human.
Regarding porn and erotica--you're right, there's a difference in the people creating the content. Totally fair.
What I was speaking to is the effect on the reader/viewer. The brain chemistry activated by one is the same brain chemistry activated by the other. The psychological aspects are similar as well.
I should have specified, but honestly the aspect of actors vs a writer (and the consent factor) never occurred to me. I was thinking purely of the person consuming the product. You're also right that that's between them and God.
On the subject of identity: I'm more concerned with what we as humans base our identity on, and how that has played out into the trans agenda (and how it's damaging the lives of so many young people.)
It's about how we see ourselves as being a captive of our body instead of seeing our body as a gift from God. (And that we are each unique to His purpose and design--and that we are not broken or somehow made wrong.) The purpose is to provide a way to view the world that is alternative to what society provides.
That works its way out in whether we're male or female (our body parts and our sexual "identity," but the way the world sees identity is so completely limited and twisted.
I just don't see this perspective coming from many places.
I love T. Kingfisher! There is some variety in their content levels, but I think they max out around 3-4 on the spice-o-meter. Meaning no fade to black but if you don’t already know how to have sex, you probably won’t learn the actual mechanics. But you might learn some good foreplay techniques. I actually really like her style, it feels very realistic without tossing out the romance.
Wow. There's a lot to love about this post. You've definitely given me a lot to think about! I appreciate how you've obviously spent a lot of time wrestling through this and also presented it in such a kind way.
As one who tends to blush at anything much above a 2.5 (?) thank you for the spice-o-meter. :)
I just recently joined this site to get more book recommendations, and was intrigued by this post title. Thanks for sharing! And for taking the time to organize these thoughts well.
For the past 8 years, (starting one year into marriage and having a lot of questions) I've loved listening to the podcast "Java with Juli" from the website "Authentic Intimacy." She is a Christian woman who is bold in tackling many different sex topic conversations!
I'll have to look into her!
Sex is such a beautiful bit of intimacy, which itself makes it difficult to talk about, but for me that is another point in favor of fiction, because it let's you learn without intruding on real people.
I agree with most of what you've had to say here--and I've had the same opinion for a very long time, actually.
I still struggle with exactly where the lines should be drawn and how to approach the subject, but I have to say that the church's (and my parents') abysmal handling of sex was part of what got me hooked on porn in the first place (A twenty-five year battle I've finally mostly won).
(Along those lines, the one serious disagreement I had with you was about erotica. It IS the same as porn in every meaningful way except the specific physiological effects. That's not to say all portrayals of sex have to be erotica--they don't.)
That said, now that I've got one novel on the way to publication, I'm seriously considering writing a fiction book for young adults that will center on the theme of sexual identity (and will, necessarily, contain sexual content).
I'm still groping for how to go about it.
On the one hand it's *SO* necessary and lacking. On the other, it's *SO* taboo that it's going to be impossible to get it "right." (Offending people doesn't phase me, so long as my own mind is settled about what I've done.)
I'd love to talk more about the problems attached to this whole issue with people who are interested, especially because I'm in the position I'm in with my own writing.
Thanks for sharing! I would be interested in what you consider meaningful ways. In that erotica and pornography are both portrayals of (often absurd) sexual fantasy for its own sake, they are the same. (I have no interest in trying to make value judgements about sexual fantasies, that's between each person and God.) I think, however, that the moment you involve real live human beings performing for other real live human beings the differences become very meaningful. Because we have souls and value, consent is critical--and you have no way of knowing if porn is actually consensual for all parties. When it's a video or photo, that is a person with a soul actively being treated as an object.
Wow, that's a big theme to tackle! I think reading other books that deal with sexual identity would probably be a useful place to start. Then maybe think about what exactly you're going for--is it just not being shy about body parts, or does the story call for more? Is the purpose to explore your own identity or explore the concept in a way that might help others?
I think the lines fall in different places for different people, and that's okay. That's part of being human.
Regarding porn and erotica--you're right, there's a difference in the people creating the content. Totally fair.
What I was speaking to is the effect on the reader/viewer. The brain chemistry activated by one is the same brain chemistry activated by the other. The psychological aspects are similar as well.
I should have specified, but honestly the aspect of actors vs a writer (and the consent factor) never occurred to me. I was thinking purely of the person consuming the product. You're also right that that's between them and God.
On the subject of identity: I'm more concerned with what we as humans base our identity on, and how that has played out into the trans agenda (and how it's damaging the lives of so many young people.)
It's about how we see ourselves as being a captive of our body instead of seeing our body as a gift from God. (And that we are each unique to His purpose and design--and that we are not broken or somehow made wrong.) The purpose is to provide a way to view the world that is alternative to what society provides.
That works its way out in whether we're male or female (our body parts and our sexual "identity," but the way the world sees identity is so completely limited and twisted.
I just don't see this perspective coming from many places.
I have made my way through most of T. Kingfisher's books upon your recommendation, so I know what you mean. What would you rate them?
I love T. Kingfisher! There is some variety in their content levels, but I think they max out around 3-4 on the spice-o-meter. Meaning no fade to black but if you don’t already know how to have sex, you probably won’t learn the actual mechanics. But you might learn some good foreplay techniques. I actually really like her style, it feels very realistic without tossing out the romance.
I would agree!
Wow. There's a lot to love about this post. You've definitely given me a lot to think about! I appreciate how you've obviously spent a lot of time wrestling through this and also presented it in such a kind way.
As one who tends to blush at anything much above a 2.5 (?) thank you for the spice-o-meter. :)
Thank you. <3
Also...I still blush....something that gives my husband considerable delight.